The One Decision That Separates Good CEOs From Great Ones

Because we kind of killed all the Native Americans, I think people think they're gone, but the Mayan civilization continues to exist and it's there. One of my co-founders is one of the software engineers at OpenAI. He said, well, most people think that we're writing the code, and that's actually not what's happening. He's like, we give it a problem and then we allow it to create a randomly large set of solutions. And then we ask it to repeat whatever it did. There's almost something selfish about having your own kids. People would not like to admit it, but just the fact that you want to have your own genetic material passed on and you don't adopt is proof enough that it's a selfish thing. That's actually not the most valuable skill set. To be a good CEO, you need to make decisions fast. Dunning-Kruger effect. You're the most confident at the beginning and then. As soon as you start learning things, you're like, oh, I actually know nothing. I'm a complete retard at this. The day my grandma died, I found like $40,000 worth of coins that was my grandmother's coin collection that would have been sold with the house and lost. Building in Guatemala, what is that like? Our workers are not motivated by money. When we want them to build faster or higher quality or do whatever. Money as an incentive didn't work.

I love things that date me. Like I, my first work classwork ever was on a typewriter. Really, yeah, I don't know how that happened. It doesn't seem like everyone else, you're 40, right? You're not 70, totally, yeah, but we had a typewriter. Where did you go to school in Vermont, like rural Vermont, I guess so. Maybe it's just a Vermont thing, I guess they got maple syrup and they got typewriters. I like saying it on dates though, yeah, because then the girl's like, wait, wait, how old are you? Am I safe? Yeah. You're not, definitely not. This is a dangerous place. Now, let me tell you about my gay experiences. Well, that's a great intro, Mr. Corey Hunter. Thank you for joining us on the show, my friend. We just had a very fun day of shooting shotguns, eating tacos and getting lost on the. Chaotic freeways of Austin, Texas. My least favorite thing about Texas is the freeways. Yeah, what's your most favorite thing about Texas?

The people, yeah, yeah. I mean, we've known each other for what, 6 weeks and you're one of my favorite humans on earth. I'm honored. Yeah, we have been, it's funny, we have been being put in the same places a lot. Like I feel like the universe is trying to push us into the same place. Even doing our mushroom ceremony, it was like, you guys are next to each other. We just keep popping up around each other. Yeah, and we're gonna be back to back music set and we're doing back to back music set. It's true. Yeah, on the same music planning committee or a party planning committee. Yeah, very good. So there's so many directions we could go with this. You're, uh, as some would call it, a renaissance man. You have so many interests, so much history and things that you've done from, I won't even get into it. I'll let you get into it. But when we talked about all the directions we could go with the podcast, I was like, We need like a seven-hour recording session to go through all this stuff. I guess the first thing I'm curious about is, have you always been eclectic in your accumulation of knowledge or Like when you were a kid, were you one of those kids that was Always trying to figure things out and just steamrolling ahead.

Hmm. This is a good question to reflect on, um. I mean, I definitely chalk it up to being an Aries sun and Sagittarius rising, so I'm like constantly, oh, and I'm a Gemini moon. So Sage rising, I'm just like epically adventurous. Gemini, I'm like always looking for different things, different people to face, and then Aries I have conviction. So I think that's what a lot of my friends mentioned is that just like I can't do anything a little bit. I like discover something and then I get obsessed with it and then I need to be with the experts in the world to get my fix and then I can like move on to the next thing. But yeah, I don't, I don't, as we talked about, I don't read very much. I feel like I just hang out with really interesting people and just ask questions constantly, and then I'm willing to get involved. Um, yeah, like I think treasure hunting has been kind of a lifelong obsession for me in various ways and has led me to meet really interesting people and be in really strange parts of the world in problematic situations. Yeah, which makes for fun times. You said you had a treasure hunting business on top of a meteor hunting business.

Tell us, tell us about these eclectic businesses you've, yeah, and then my new obsession is in ambergris business. Ambergrisse, yeah, OK. Have you heard of ambergris? So, um, it's very metal. I think nature is metal in general, but, um, so sperm whales hunt, um, deep sea squid, um, but deep sea squid's beaks are not digestible. And so sperm whales have to produce this like special oil in their stomach to like pass the beak through their body. And then that oil coagulates and hardens and then eventually the sperm whale has to vomit it out or poop it out. Um, and then it floats on the top of the ocean, getting concentrated by the sun as it dries, and then floats up on shore and you can, uh, sell it for $100,000 a kilogram to perfume shops in Paris, uh, to make the world's finest fragrance. And that's Ambergris. Ambergris. Yeah, interesting. So long story short, when I was 6 years old, um, my grandma, the day my grandma died, I was avoiding her death and exploring places to hide in the house, really, and found this trap door next to the fireplace in this old New England colonial house where you used to pile wood in from the outside and then pull it in another trap door from the inside.

And I crawled in and inside there was no wood, but there was a loose brick. And I pull out the loose brick and behind it is this little, um, shoebox, like jewelry box. Pull that out and open it up and it's filled with gold and silver coins. So as a 6 year old, I found like $40,000 worth of coins. That was my grandmother's coin collection that would have been sold with the house and lost if I hadn't somehow. Divine Providence a treasure hunter like found that, yeah. So then I became obsessed with treasure of all sorts and I got very into coin collecting and uh I was the young numismatist of the Year in America in 1998. So like the top kid coin collector, so like super obsessed and, uh, yeah, that's continued. So I, I have a small hotel in Guatemala, which Guatemala was the um, the capital of the Spanish invasion of the Americas. And that's kind of how I got there is chasing that story. So there's a story of El Dorado, like the last city of gold, and, um, the last Mayan king told all of the subjects when, when the Mayan Empire was about to fall to throw all their gold in Lake Atitlan, which is where my hotel is based. And when you go to Antigua, um, the streets of Antigua are all, uh, cobblestone. Um, it's European cobblestone.

And people just take it for granted, but the reason that cobblestone is there is because the Spanish would sail treasure ships across the ocean filled with ballast stones from Europe, and then unload them in Guatemala and replace them all with gold and silver, and then sail those ships back. So 2 out of every 3 of those ships sunk, um, because, uh, the, the Caribbean has 2 things that the Mediterranean doesn't, which is coral reefs and hurricanes. And so that's kind of where a lot of this mythology at that time came from too is that there's like they felt like there was the Bermuda Triangle and spirits and like all this crazy stuff because they were just sailing into a phenomenon they never encountered. And so back in the day, a ship can't go backwards, uh, it doesn't have that capability. So if you run into a reef, it's toast, it's over, um, and so sometimes they would unload all that gold and silver on another ship, but oftentimes with hurricanes and stuff, the ships would just get smashed to pieces and it would fall into the ocean. So.

There's more gold and silver in the world's oceans than in all of the world's museums combined, um, and most of it is just right off the coast of Florida in what's called the Treasure Coast, um, and each shipwreck is like $500 million to $2 billion in gold and silver. So is that a big industry of divers that go down and just look for gold and silver and treasure? Um, no, because the ocean's really big and gas is expensive and, um. It's hard, um, but we're now kind of at this like almost singularity moment with technology advancing where um it's going to get a lot easier to figure out where everything is. Um, and so I started a company to create, um, self-driving drones, uh, that search for metal signatures, um, on the ocean floor. And so we're going to start deploying those next year, but they're all solar powered, and so there's no gas cost, there's no human error, because when you're running transects in the ocean with waves and a guy running trying to drive a, um, metal detector behind him, the the data ends up being really messy. So, Anyways, we're creating uh uh maps of where all the gold and silver is and then I could go, I, we could talk for for hours and hours about treasure hunting. It's so interesting. How did you end up in Austin?

Um, And you've been only here for a short time, yeah, yeah, um, and where did you come from, like before, where did you go? Cotton Eye Joe. no no no no no. I, yeah, I mean, I feel like I've been nomadic for the past 7 years, so that's been the classic question is like where do I live, um, but I think you have been kind of moving all over, moving all over, yeah, and what do you, what brought you here you feel, or you just popped in. Yeah, what, what I think Austin has the most interesting group of people I've ever met, um, and I've lived in Paris, lived in New York, lived, um, all over the world, Thailand, whatever, and I don't know. I don't know why. I don't know why people are so interesting here. Did you? This place is boring. There's no mountains. There's no ocean. There's no forest. That's why the people are interested. Did you, did you have somebody say, Hey, come here, or did you just like see it on a map or hear about it? Or like, what was the thing that like you decided to fly here? My old roommate Kavon from New York City, um, built a community house here and spent, uh, 2.5 years on a very intensive sales campaign trying to convince me to come here.

And I thought he was insane, and I thought there was 0% chance I would ever move here, but Yeah, I just don't even want to leave the house. Like everyone I meet, you guys included, it's just like so fascinating. Um, like what is it comparable to when you travel or like is it a mix of different places you travel? Like how would you try to describe it? I always feel it's interesting to hear people describe. Their experience of Austin is always just so interesting to me. Well, my biggest bases have been San Francisco, New York, and Guatemala. And I think this is the perfect combination of those three, which is like San Francisco has like no culture, but it has the coolest ideas. And then New York has the sort of like most world traveling, like interesting people, but it has too much. Nightlife and drugs and like you never sleep. And then Guatemala has like super spiritual people at the lake, this belly button of civilization of Mayan culture for thousands of years, but they're like way too woo. And so Austin is kind of like just the right amount of woo, just the right amount of good ideas, just the right amount of interesting people like all together.

That's, that's a good way to describe it. What do you, why build a spot in Lake Attilan? It's the most beautiful view I've ever seen in my life. Um, I don't know if you remember that movie Shangri-La from like the 40s or something. It's like a black and white movie, but um, yeah, it's like, you know, it's like three giant volcanoes right on the edge of a 17 mile lake with like a cascading jungle falling down the sides and it's at altitude, so it's perfect 72 degrees every day year round. It's like. Yeah, it's like a paradise place. Um, and it's fascinating. It's a collapsed former super volcano that erupted 84,000 years ago and, uh, was such a large eruption. That pieces of it fell in Florida and in Colombia from Guatemala. Um, so yeah, massive deal, and then the, the volcano, the caldera collapsed and then filled with water. 17 miles is a volcano, right? Yeah, so it's essentially the world's witches cauldron because there's still a super volcano underneath it.

That's crazy that there's a volcano under that lake, yeah. I remember hearing that and then I've been telling everybody that, but it's been so long I was like maybe I'm making this up and I remember it wrong telling people to that there's a volcano under there. Yeah, like, wait, maybe that's not great. Well, there's proof because every 15 minutes one of the, uh, puff will poof. Is it Fuego or I think it's Fuego, yeah. There was one time when it got kind of, I was down there and it was like really spitting, and there was a moment where I was like, oh, it's about to go off. I'm about to those movies where like everyone gets vaporized, because that's what they would tell us like if that thing goes off, we're toast immediately. It's like, this might be it, here we go. At least you go out in paradise. Totally. I mean, whatever. It's gonna, it's gonna be the most epic thing you've ever seen in your entire life if you do go that way to be able to see a volcano like explode, like really explode, that'd be better than being in an assisted living facility, right?

Yeah, I think if the world's going to end, you want a front row seat, yeah, to the greatest, you know. Thing that Mother Nature could do, you know, erupt. Great science fact about volcanoes if you're interested. So a lot of people think that, you know, volcanoes is like exploding fire, but it's actually exploding water. It's water that causes the eruption. Yeah. So when the, when the continents, when the continental plates, when one is subducting underneath the other, the water from the ocean gets trapped in that. And then the farther down that water logged. Land goes, it's the water starts to pressurize and then the water pressurizes with the lava that it hits and then forces the lava up through those cracks to release the water. Wow, I'm curious, building in Guatemala, what is that like? And then how did you, do you have a friend that's an architect? Like how did you design it? Because I remember being down there, there was people were always building. Different like spots for people to stay and the architecture was always so beautiful and it seems like you can get pretty creative down there so it'd be kind of cool because you just opened it, right? in a week, yeah, so it'd be kind of cool to give us a rundown of the whole process of opening it and like the layout of everything and Yeah, what do you got going on there to, yeah, well, so, you know, referring back to the term Renaissance man, not that I use that for myself, but I think one thing about being a person with a lot of interests, um, is that it helps to have to know people that are experts, and I think one of my strategies in life, which I've like post reflected on is that I think I'm really good at picking jockeys. And so just like meeting a person and understanding what their special talent is.

And so in Guatemala, you know, it's the most beautiful place in the world to me, um, and I wanted to build there, but I definitely didn't want to get sucked into like needing to learn everything there was about building in that place, or else I have to like abandon all my other interests. And so I met a man named Dar Sernoff, who I feel is the most talented builder in Guatemala, and just by the will of God, we became very close friends and he was like, Do you want to, I got some extra land. Do you want to buy it next to me? And he was like, Oh, and by the way, I'm building my house so I can just, um, send my workers to your land after and build one for you and then manage it. And it was just like too many like obvious yeses, but, um, but I have been pretty involved in the project even though he's been building it, um, from designing it with, um, just like a guy on his PC, uh, in a cafe on the streets in Guatemala, um, to, yeah, dealing with, uh, all the worker situations. I think some of the most interesting stuff is that One, Guatemala is a libertarian country, which I love, um, and I, I really, I just appreciate the philosophy of like, I'm gonna trust you to like do whatever you need to do in life and trust you and I'm, and I want you guys to trust me and like I don't want to be in your business and I don't want you in mine and like just.

Don't do anything evil and like, you know, I kind of I really like that um foundation and I used to live in Oakland, California, which was like a bit libertarian also just functionally, um, but Um, but that means that like you can do cool stuff. Like there's no, there's no building codes and so everyone is kind of, and we were kind of talking about this earlier that when you give people freedom, you, you actually ask them to be more responsible and I think people rise to the occasion. And so, you know, the place that we are building in Guatemala that opens a week in a week is a steel frame structure, um, bolted into the top of a 100 ft cliff 300 ft above the lake. So it's very much kind of like my dream, kind of like James Bond. Villa, um, but you couldn't build it in America, um, and so nobody came and checked it, you know, we have to like make sure that our building's not going to collapse and you have to learn a lot of stuff. It's like you're building on the edge of a volcano. You're literally building on a volcano, so like earth.

Earthquakes, landslides, like, so the, you know, the whole foundation of the house is lifted on stilts so that if the uh mountain behind us, which is a 45 degree angle, very steep, if it slides, hopefully the dirt will slide under the house and not take the whole thing out. Um, but yeah, but we're also like bolted into the bedrock, um, and that bedrock is actually the um According to Mayan lore, um, that line of bedrock is one of the right gates to the underworld, um, in, in traditional May Mayan mythology, um, and the Lake Ajalo is considered the belly button of, of the universe. Um, so yeah, it's a very like rich and powerful place, and I'm generally, I'm, you know, I'm a like fundamentalist non-dualist, so I believe that everything is God and we are that and there's no separation. And so in that sense, like everything is sacred. I don't like think some things are more sacred than another. That's my philosophy. But when you're at the lake, I definitely like bow to the lake spirit. Um, she definitely feels feminine, like loves to, um, take things from you that are out of alignment, um, and like push you to your edges and It seems to me that you very much have to listen. Like, does she want you at the lake or does she want you to leave? And if she wants you to leave, she starts taking things from you.

Do you have an example of that? Um, well, the, the day after I bought my land, um, there was a, a brush fire and it all burned, um, which I think was her testimon of like, you know, I like God put things in line so easily for you, like, but this is not going to be a cakewalk. Like you understand, like, are you really committed to this project? Do you really want to be here, um, or if things get a little scary, are you going to run, um, and, uh, yeah, so I had to push through that and then. Um, yeah, I was in a long relationship that also was out of alignment, and she took that from me. So, do you have any Profound experiences you've had at the lake? Like mystical ones or just like gay experiences. Yeah, just like, you know, people report, I mean, you're saying. It's this You know, place that called you and clearly you love it enough to build, you know, your James Bond hotel, and I It has kind of a magicalness to it.

And it can just be, I don't know, an experience that could be synchronicity or something, but I imagine there must be some moments that you must cherish that happened at the lake that different than any other experiences in the world. Hmm That is a good question. Um, Well, Something that's very different about it is um. You know, um, Mayan, the Mayan culture is dominant, um, there, and Mayan culture is way more ancient than Western culture. And so I think because we kind of killed all the Native Americans, I think people think they're gone, but the Mayan civilization continues to exist and it's there. Um, and it's, it's. Uh, epigenetic value system is fundamentally different from the West, and I encountered this in our build because, um, our workers are not motivated by money.

And so we, we, we want them to build faster or higher quality or do whatever, money as an incentive didn't work. And so we had to like figure out other ways. And um when I was interviewing some of our workers, um, I asked them, you know, where's the, where's the best this material or that material on the lake, and I noticed that they all kept saying wherever the town was from was all the best things. And so then I asked, I was like, well, have you ever like been to been to the other town? And this is like a 40 year old guy, and he was like, no. And so the, the, the like family values are so strong that it's almost like there isn't even a reason why you would want to leave your house, leave your family, leave your town, um, which like I think even for us Westerners is like really hard to understand. It's like it's, it's a 15 minute walk to the other town and they've like never done it. At least that's what they're telling me, um. And so after learning that, I was like, OK, there's the tribalism is actually really, really strong. And so what we did was we divided our teams. So we have a metal team from one town, a wood team from another town, um, a glass team from another town, cement team from another town.

And so when the teams would work together, we would sort of set up a competition and like whoever sort of is recognized as making the most progress that week gets a pizza party. And then, and then at the end of the week we would serve pizza up at the like amate tree, very corporate tools, a pizza party. Exactly. Yeah. And the amate tree overlooks the house and all the other workers who didn't win get to watch the other town celebrate and eat their pizza while they finish their workday. So anyways, I mean, that's like, you know, it's a little bit of a western, yeah, uh, uh, but it's a blend. It's like it is the western, you know, kind of quintessential like, here's your pizza party like in the corporate work environment like you worked all, all quarter, here's your pizza party, good job. But it does play into their cultural family values and that like natural competition and tribalism of this is the best tribe. Everything we do is the best over there is, yeah, they're probably cool, but it's not. It's not what we do. So I like that. I like that you found the back door into motivation, which is just, yeah, psychology.

Yeah, and I think part of that too is like wanting to be aligned with their culture, understanding that ours is like a layer in our mind. It's the dominant layer, but it's actually a pretty thin layer that we kind of plopped on top of this 1000 year old, multi 1000 year old culture and That's one thing that's special about the lake too is that, um, it because of that, um, it's importance in Mayan civilization, it's been an important capital in um Native American awareness for thousands of years. And so there's a lot of, um, tribal leaders that come to the lake and do ceremonies, um, there and I went to one peyote ceremony from um a tribal leader from northern Mexico and at the end of the ceremony, she was um she was singing songs that I remembered from my childhood in Alaska. And I was like, I asked her afterward, I was like, how is it possible that I'm hearing like Haida Alaskan songs from Mexico in Guatemala? And she was like, Oh, well, we're we're all the same coalition.

I was like, what do you mean coalition? And she's like, oh, we're all, we're all eagle coalition. And so apparently from Alaska to Guatemala is Eagle Coalition and from Nicaragua down to Argentina is Condor Coalition. And that's how those civilizations are divided. And she was saying that the word Guatemala actually in the native tongue means where the eagle lands. And so there's like this like deep fundamental structure that I think living at the lake has made me aware of that I've only seen like the edge of it in these like little ways where like people are not motivated by money or you know, I can hear the same song, but it's definitely made me inspired to like learn about another. Um, much more ancient and current, uh, culture. That's exciting. Will you spend more time there, or are you just still kind of hopping around, or is this your spot for now? I, I, I think I, I, I struggle with sticking with things, um, nothing wrong with that, yeah, um.

So I originally started building this as a music retreat, um, because I've been focusing on music a lot the past 5 years and the view is so spectacular that the idea of like writing music to that view felt very inspiring, but I think I've realized that I like writing music at the ocean, um, because the rhythm of the waves and, uh, to me is very musical and like draws out that creativity. Um, so I don't know. Yeah, so I think it's, it'll be sort of. You know, I like, I picked up the James Bond gun earlier. I'm like kind of leaning into this James Bond identity. Like I think it will be, you know, one of the, the sky base, let's say. But, uh, yeah, I think next I'm looking for an ocean base. You're gonna work on an album, music. It sounds like you're doing a lot of things. You're using drones to find gold. You have a James Bond Guatemala hotel. You're gonna write music at the ocean. What else we got? What else we got? Oh man, is that the main, or you just have usually many things going on at once.

And you're just orchestrating it all at the same time. Yeah, I think I've noticed by myself that I have one year of getting really excited about a new thing. Like right now I'm kind of obsessed with ambergris, and then there's a year of getting competent at that thing and like playing in the world, trying to play with experts, and then there's a year of getting bored of the thing and looking for the next thing, and they're all kind of like overlapping. Um, and I think it's, it's been getting worse the older I've gotten because I think the dopamine hit of like a new thing doesn't, like, you know, any drug doesn't hit as hard as the last one. So I'm leaning to layer more and more and more things. You need a bigger thing like Elon, something that's such a complicated problem. It takes, take a lifetime, it takes longer than a year. Like you need a bigger problem. Uh, are you dabbling in AI at all? Like, do you have any interest in going into that? Cause it seems like that could be a rabbit hole that's kind of endless. Yeah, I, I think just growing up in Alaska, I'm, I'm, I'm a hard assets guy. Like I, I don't think in tech, um, and you know, like when I was a kid, like, My dad would hunt moose and, you know, bring it home and chop it up and then we'd be eating moose for a year. It's like I grew up on an island off the coast of Alaska, so it's like kind of the farthest you could get from civilization. So yeah, technology doesn't make sense to me, but, um, like I said, I feel like I'm good at picking jockeys and, um, one of my co-founders on the treasure hunting project is one of the software engineers at OpenAI.

Um, and so, but it's been interesting to learn about what AI is useful for and what it's not, and um. It was kind of amazing actually asking him just like. As a civilian, like, can you just try to explain to me what's happening in the algorithm in the simplest way possible? And he said, he said, well, most people think that we're writing the code that it's using to go get the answers, and that's actually not what's happening. Um, he's like, we give it a problem and then we allow it to create a randomly large set of solutions. And then one of those solutions probabilistically is right. And then we find the one that's right according to the question, and then we ask it to repeat whatever it did. And we apply that to the next question, the next question, the next question and refine it until it's answering everything right, but we have no idea how it's doing it. They're also on the edge. So this is one of the lead engineers, like software engineers at OpenAI and doesn't understand how it's doing what it's doing.

Which is kind of like life too. We don't, we don't, or yeah, does God know how it's working? It's, it's more just like once you have an, it's the same as all the pioneering like quantum. Like nobody, even the best quantum mechanics still have no or the best quantum, uh, like physicists have no idea how it works. Particle and wave at the same time, they don't get it. We don't know So you I noticed have done more in your years of life so far. than most families would do in their whole lives put together. Why do you think that is? What are you doing differently? Hm, well, probably not feeling good enough is helpful, um, because I, you know, you asked me that and I'm like, well, I'm not, I'm really not succeeding very much like compared to my idols, you know, like a person like Elon, I'm like, how is he doing that like just superhuman abilities and with like deep purpose that's like very big and also raising kids at the same time and like also being funny.

You know, he'll lose, lose a couple billion dollars like here and there and he's like cracking jokes about it, you know, and me, I like forget to take my bottles to the grocery store and I'm like upset. And like Yeah, so, I mean, I think it's a big question that I'm reflecting on, reflecting on, like just turning 40 has hit me super hard, like way more than I thought, um, and I think like, why am I doing the things that I'm doing, um, and how do I have lasting fulfillment, um, are big questions. And I mean, I wonder for you guys how you feel about that too, like the kind of the big question of like, do you need kids in your life to feel fulfilled. I had the same thing happen to me. So I turned 40 almost a year ago. So I'll turn 41 in January 17. And the same thing, it's like you turn 40 and you're like, You don't think it's going to be any different, but it is totally different in that you're like, OK. It's serious now, and I don't know why it feels that way, but you're like, I'm in the 2nd half.

And the first half was You know, you can make mistakes in this, but you're like, everything counts from this point forward and you don't get chances to fuck around. But what do I want this to be about? Like, this is where it's like your statement piece, right? And You got to do like, do you want to have kids? Do you like, how do you like, you got to really start making those decisions now, or at least have a clear idea where you're kind of figuring out in your 20s and 30s, but now you're like, OK, we're like, because in 10 years, you're 50, and now you're really, And a, a full human adult being like, you know, so it is this. Interesting process of trying to figure it out and I, I don't know, I don't know. It's been a year and I don't know, but it is a definite, it did like it did. I never thought it would be this. Impactful deep reflection of like, OK. And so that's why I like, I've been wanting to really take time off because I'm like, I need to really reflect on my life. Everything I've gone through, everything I've done, I really need to sit deeply and really, really think.

To then move into the next piece confidently, cause if you don't, it is gonna just be all of a sudden you're 50, and then all of a sudden you're 60, and so you do have this like unique opportunity to really Decide and figure out from your past, like what, you know, what do you want your life to be like from this point forward and like, do you really want kids and all that and Yeah, you gotta, you gotta make it, you gotta like kind of make some decisions. It's like the last train stop. You know, of Tokyo's coming by real quick and you're on the bullet train, and it's coming, you're like, are you gonna get off? Are you gonna go off? Are you gonna get off? You're like, I don't know. So you gotta decide, like, are you gonna have kids? Are you're gonna do this and this and, later, but it's like, I don't know, do I really want to be a Have a 10 year old when I'm 50. I don't know. Like, why not? I mean, with the amount of like, but like stem cells and everything, you could live you got 150 maybe, but you gotta think about it. Like, do I, as you age, I don't know about you, but like you get a little more solidified in your piece. Do you know what I mean? And You're like, this is really nice, and now I'm less and less wanting to give this up. So now, as though I'm more mature and self-assured, the less I even want to share that with anybody.

Does that ring true? Yeah, definitely. And you're like, and if I get older, I think it's gonna get worse in a good way for me, but not for anybody else. Yeah, I think it also gets tough because, you know, as we've been talking about some of our individual successes, and I think as we have more like resources and wisdom and confidence and also sexiness, like I something I didn't realize when I was younger that like men get sexier as we get sexier as we age. This is dope. I know I don't want to stop this. No, that is a cruel trick on men is that your whole twenties. No woman wants to look at you. You have no resources to do anything. And then as soon as you finally get those things, then it's like, that's the age everybody has kids. You're like, cool, I guess I just won't do anything I wanted to do now. And I won't use my sexiness that I just acquired, or you just Be like us and be 40 and or that guy just having a great old time. At the moment I'm trying to split the difference and I have a female friend who's also 40 who doesn't have a partner and I'm uh donating sperm so that she can have a baby into some kind of engagement. Yeah, it's contractual, and I have no fatherly responsibilities. It's only a tissue donation, but there is like a little piece of my indecision that's satisfied by like, OK, well, the kid will happen.

And maybe I still get to play. Best of both worlds. I feel like, I think this is the main problem. There's not enough time. I feel like I'm just kind of figuring shit out kind of right now. And you want me to make all these decisions, and you see people around you in the 30s and whatever 20s, and you're like, how did you decide you wanted to do that and have kids and you go to the PTA movie. And you're driving your kids to soccer. I mean, I trained, uh, I'm a trainer, so I trained a bunch of clients, and I'm looking at them like, what, like, how did you decide all these things? I feel like I'm still just, just getting into understanding how everything's even working. I feel like maybe in 20 years, I could be maybe ready, but then you're like, but based on how the human body ages, I can't be. So like, it's such a weird experience. You're like, how did you guys all decide you want to do that already? I feel like we're just, yeah, I do feel like, like my idea of what is value is shifting a lot. And I think lately it's been my feeling is that clarity is the most valuable currency in life. And I think that's part of what has led me to do a lot of psychedelic ceremonies, which I know you guys do as well. Um.

That's just a lamp. That's not a mushroom. I thought that was a guy wearing a hat. Or an atom bomb explosion. It's like, yes, oh yeah, it is an explosion in your mind. Which is something else that's pretty fun to collect, um, is that when, um, nuclear explosions go off, they, um, they create glass shards, um, that also, they're called techites, which is also what happens when meteorites hit Earth and stuff like that. And so, um, you can get, you can collect tectite. This is a collection I've been wanting to have, but it's kind of dangerous. I've had a few pieces of techite, yeah, and you can collect them from the famous nuclear explosions of history, which is kind of dark, but, um. They will kill you, but there's a little radiation in those things, yeah. Yeah, yeah, but we all grew up with Velveeta mac and cheese, and if we can survive Velveeta and Tide Pods, yeah, well, some of us that I still use because I hate all of the, I just, I fucking, I tried, I tried to fucking use all the like clean fucking products. They don't fucking clean your clothes. I'm sorry. So I went back to the goddamn Tide Pods. So the only thing that made my clothes actually feel like they're clean, I can't stand those fucking products. All right, this is a side rant.

This episode is brought to you by Tide Pods. Go out and get your Tide Pods. Use, use code T1G for 15% off your next purchase of Tide Pods. Visit Coreyhuntermusic.com. So we have a, I have a good question for you. So our buddy, just give us your live reaction. He says when he introduced people to DMT, what he likes to do is he has them take 3 hits, each hit lasting 10 seconds, and then makes them hold it for 10 seconds. What do you think about that and how do you do? Like a true, I'm gonna go into DMT world. Um, well, I think he's probably talking about NNDMT and dimethyltryptamine, which is the more like businessman's high, the sort of like quick, like everything disintegrates into beautiful fractal visuals, you know, lasts a couple of minutes, and then you come back. Um, I like that DMT for like funsies at sunset, but, um, I have a lot more experience with 5 MEO DMT, um, so what's the difference, um.

Well, there was a, there was a researcher at one point that tried to create a scale of, um, like psychedelic intensity, um, and so, um, you know, it's all subjective, so it's hard to, uh, say that it's right, but, you know, less than 100 is like, you know, mushrooms and weed and Um, and then DMT is like a couple 100 then like 5 MEO DMT is like 10,000 or something. So it's the theoretically it's the strongest psychedelic that we know of that's like in circulation and as far as my experience goes, um, it's the only one where I feel that the, the term ego death that people sometimes use for various ketamine or mushroom ceremonies or whatever. I don't, I don't experience ego death in those, but In 5MEO DMT I have an entry into a disintegration of self where um I have no more goalposts in time, um, and I also don't understand the difference between me and anything else in space. And so once you lose like uh time and space, then the experience is sort of fundamentally eternal, has a taste of eternity.

Um, and, um, as does death theoretically, um, even though logically death is not real, which I love talking about if you guys want my proof. Yeah, so it's like, you know, I think logically there's two options to death, like either, either when you die, there is no experience, in which case you can't experience not experiencing. There's no way to experience not experiencing. So you're never going to experience not experiencing. So in that case, the death is never going to arrive, um, like your experience will last eternally, I suppose, because you couldn't experience not experiencing eternally to you, eternally to you, yeah, totally. The alternative is that after death there is some experience, in which case it's not death either. So kind of like this question that I feel like freaked me out when I was a kid, like is the universe finite or that's weird, like what's on the other side or is the universe infinite? Well, that's weird. It goes on forever into what like I don't understand like. I think there's like logical problems, paradoxes that the mind can't handle, which are just like pointers to us, pointers to humility that we just have no fucking idea what's going on. But I spent most of my life being very, very scared of death, and I think that's what led me to 5 MEO DMT ceremonies in the first place was to try to experience it and Each time I genuinely feel like I am dying. I feel like the shaman has overdosed me. I'm like, fuck, I made a huge mistake and this is the end of my life and I genuinely feel that my life is ending. Um, and so it's the deepest fear experience of my life. I project fear into death. Some people project other things, um, and I'm jealous of them, but, uh, And then on the other side, I have the most absolutely consistently the most beautiful experience of my life, like coming back into identity.

How does that compare when you've done ayahuasca experiences? Do you feel there's any crossover at all or completely different? Yeah, completely different experiences, I think, um, I have started to prefer synthetic 5 AmiO DMT. Um, I've done the natural version which for like, um, animal rights reasons people tend to discourage, but also it's just, it's chemically really messy. There's like a lot of other stuff in there that can shift your experience a lot. And make it inconsistent. And the synthetic 5MEO DMT for me, which is also present in Ayahuasca, is just such a pure, clear experience that for me when I want to be blasted into death and then returned to life is very effective at that. And Ayahuasca for me is also like really inconsistent. It's like it depends on where they're getting the plant from and how they dried it and like who's the shaman and what their ceremony is, and I love doing ceremonies with all different shamans mainly because I just think they're, it's like going to different concerts, um, you know, almost every shaman is a very talented musician and you're on their drug in their setting with their, you know, accouterment, and I think it's, it's cool, but I don't feel like I've been able to do as fundamental work with Ayahuasca as I have with 5MEO DMT.

And most recently in Mexico, um, when I was very deep in my Um, trying to get out of, uh, addiction, um, to my, uh, past relationship. Um, I, uh, the shaman there encouraged me to do a triple stack of first, um, doing combo. To purge and clear the body and empty and open it up to receive then 15 minutes later, 5 MEO DMT, which is like you're already empty and open. Now it's fully blasting you into death. And then as you're coming out, then once you just have enough clarity to smoke again, which is another 20 minutes, then you smoke changa, um, which is like a full disintegration into love. And so what is? Chonga is like a, it's a new invention, um, new recipe of like the past 20 years, which is um like a handful of herbs um plus DMT together, um, that is absolutely my favorite drug in the world. It's a rich, vivid, loving flower fractal paradise, um, and very gentle, um, and expansive and you know what herbs.

I don't know. You can ask Chachi BT for the recipe, um, but are there particular regions where the shamans will use this, or there's no shamans because it's new. It's like 15 or 20 years. Um, so it's just like showed up in Australia. Um, I think some DMT hipsters like invented it. Yeah, it has an MOA inhibitor and herbal tea. Yeah, like a modern day light Aya for social settings. Yeah, and it is, it's really, I did it at sunrise with my best friends at Burning Man. And is it smoked in a vape or is it like how is it served? Um, Well, if you have a joint, the issue is that you're, you're like burning gold, and so like in between breaths, like your gold is kind of burning to the world. So, um, I like the joint because you get the biggest hit, but you also waste the most and so, so it's like a joint with DMT sprinkled into it more or less, but without weed it's like other herbs. Yeah, it's like a smoking blend with DMT with an MOA inhibitor also, OK, yeah, um.

But, um, yeah, so most people do it like more efficiently in a pipe and you like, you also can separate the DMT crystals and the herbs, um, and so you can just put the herbs in the pipe and then sprinkle the DMT crystals on top and um do it that way. But I'm very curious to find out the herbs. Yeah, I will find out. But anyway, so I stacked combo and 5MEO and Changa, um, which is the most extreme drug experience I've ever had, um, and I did it 3 days in a row, um, me and this crystal meth addict, um, which I thought was telling of the depth of my addiction, um, and, uh, I the takeaway from that is that there's also a very powerful medicine in life which is called gentleness and that maybe I had reached the edge of where forcing clarity was helpful. But yeah. That's, that's uh What do you feel like was at the core of the addiction? Do you feel like you've processed that and let that go, or is that still an ongoing process?

I mean, it's, I feel like it's very related to what you were talking about in terms of 40 really putting present that like life is short and you need to make decisions and I think that um My whole life I've been part of going all these directions is that I, I thought I could just collect like people I loved and talents and good experiences and and then get to keep them forever. And I don't know about you guys, but I like, I feel like I overlook pretty big details about life and like, like that was one of them. Like I thought I got to keep things forever and like now when 40 hit, it was like, no, dude, like you don't have that much time and like. You know, it's like, it's fun to do a bunch of maybes. But like, what are your fuck yeses in life? And I think having a fuck yes means having a no, and I've been really unwilling to have any nos. Cause life is dope in all directions. I don't wanna, I don't want to say no to anything, right? I know there's so many interesting, cool things to do.

Yeah, do you feel Like, what do you have a process or like a thought about a process to help yourself figure that out, or are you still trying to figure out how to figure it out? No, I think arriving in Austin was part of that, um, that formula, which I think a big download was that, um. The mind is a really powerful tool, but, um, ultimately it's not the leader of the system that, um, you know, the heart and the gut are the leaders, but they're much more sensitive, um, organs to listen to. Um, and so, um, my mind actually told me that I needed to move to Topanga, California, um, but, um, when I checked in with my heart and my gut and my pelvis, all those centers wanted to be in Austin. And that was the really the first real decision I made in my life, uh, from those centers, um, and I'm trying to do that as my way to find like what are my fuck yeses, but it's a bit confusing because I think given the way I talk, you can see I'm like a pretty like heady kind of person and like to solve things there, but it hasn't gotten me to like peace and fulfillment.

Well, it sounds like it solves you. It's helped you solve and do a lot of really good shit. You just have to meld the two. So maybe that's like your life path is like you're hyper-developed in that way and it's incredible, but now it's developing that so they can meet and that's, it seems like you're starting to tune into. And so that's just, Where you're at, right? Because I imagine there's a lot of people that wish they could start a business every year and then blow it up and sell it and do all this cool shit, right? So you probably have a lot to offer and I imagine there's some people here that can help just exchange the wisdom and you'll get what you need. And it sounds like you're doing what you're supposed to, like you already are doing something you haven't done before is following that. And I think that's all you can kind of do is just follow that next step and through reflection, you've discovered that, right? Yeah. Yeah, I think another element that's coming into view is service, and I think, I think maybe, you know, if I don't have kids, I think that service is in the same frequency. And, uh, yeah, I think, I think as men, I think, you know, when we're younger, accumulation is pretty important. Like I need to get powerful, I need to get attractive. I need to have resources. I'm the provider. I need to step into that space. And then I think once you have it, like we do now, it's like it's time to give it away.

Um, and so, yeah, I've been, I've been enjoying. Uh, applying my gifts to other people, kind of like what you're saying, like I find businesses starting businesses very easy, um, and a lot of people don't, and like helping people has been really inspiring for me. Like, um, after I sold my first company, um, in, uh, 2018, I started doing executive coaching for other entrepreneurs in various industries, um, and, uh, It's amazing how when you can When you can help someone with their dream, like realize it in a way that they can't by themselves, um, yeah, it's a really rewarding feeling and in the same way I imagine parenting would be, um, but I've also learned a lot I feel like from watching entrepreneurs like of all the CEOs that I coached, um, for a long time, I assumed that. You had to be like really, really smart and make good decisions to be a CEO. And from my observation, that's actually not the most, most valuable skill set. Like to be a good CEO you need to make decisions fast. It's all about making decisions fast. Because if you're sitting, if your boats sitting in port and just like thinking about how you're going to sail around the world, you're actually, you're collecting no data about how to actually sail.

But if you just leave the port and you don't even know where you're going, you're going to get information right away. Like, is the boat sinking? Is the boat heading into the wind, like, and if you're going the right way, great, you keep going. If you're going the wrong way, you tack and you go the right way. So it's just like quick action is beats, uh, being right. Yeah, that is extremely true. I agree. Just send it and just keep sending it until you don't have any money and then you take a pause and then you send it once you got more money. Just keep going. I, I, my sister's been reading this book about dads and like all the studies about like the physiology of like what a dad was because I guess way back in the day, there wasn't really dads. Like the women raised it and there might a bunch of be a bunch of guys and they don't really know necessarily where the kids came from. And eventually, can I, before you keep going, can I double click on that? Because this is one of my favorite facts about humanity, which is that up until recently this book, I haven't read this book, we talked about this the first time we met at that party.

We had this conversation. Yeah, I remember you telling me about this. Yeah, so for most of human history, for like 300,000 years, humans didn't know how a woman got pregnant. Which I think is super overlooked because there's a 9 month delay and there wasn't modern medicine. And so we didn't know, was it volume of sexual partners? Was it volume of sperm? Was it having sex under the full moon? We had no idea. And so as a result, we also didn't know who's who was the father ever. All we knew was that that baby came out of that woman. And so for most of human history, like that's where like the mother-baby connection comes from, is that it's not, there isn't a dad. And also that's why like the community was taking care of the women and the families and would be bound together. Um, so this idea of like, there's a dad and there's a mom and there's a baby and we're a nuclear family is like a super new idea, which is very experimental.

And that's what she said in the book. It's, it's, it's a very new thing. And then the things that happen to a male when he becomes a dad. But one of the main points is that Children don't need their biological father. But children, it's better if they do have their biological mother. They just need a father figure. And so as men, You don't necessarily have to experience being a father and by having your own kid. You can just be that role that is just as impactful to many kids. So that's kind of a I thought that was interesting. Yeah, one of my main mentors from my childhood, after my big breakup, I was calling him for help and, um, because he is in his second marriage and, uh, his first wife cheated on him and it was very intense for him and I wanted to understand that grief. And, um, I asked him about making the decision about kids because I was kind of worried my relationship ending. Maybe I don't get to have kids now and like, Um, and he said that he actually made a calculated decision to not have kids because he felt that when he was growing up, um, his family didn't have enough resources, particularly his dad, to like help him out and have a good childhood.

And from that experience, he realized that there's a lot of families that just don't have enough resources to show up for the kid and that if he didn't have kids, he could be that extra adult that helps out filling all those gaps in so many families and he thought he could make a bigger impact in the life of children by not having children than having his own nuclear-focused family. I mean, that makes sense. There's almost something selfish about having your own kids. I mean, people would not like to admit it, but just the fact that you want to have your own genetic material passed on and you don't adopt is proof enough that it's a selfish like that. And also it's like you hear people talk about, oh, the greatest fulfillment is having a child, but that's your fulfillment. Yeah, which I guess is one thing, but it's, I mean, I get it though. It's like it's this, it's part of the human experience. It's like one of the major, it's like. Having a DMT experience is like this profound experience. It's like, I get if certain people, but I think certain people are wired. To want that, yeah, and I don't know about you. Well, it's also cultural because I know a lot of people culturally, like a lot of my Mexican or Hispanic friends, the men, even at young ages, they're like, I need kids. I gotta have kids. I wanna have kids, but you can tell it's not like it's something inside them that's like, I wanna do it and it's like in their DNA to just breed like they wanna raise children. I was just talking to my friend yesterday who's Mexican. He's like, I just can't wait to have kids, man. Like I really wanna have kids.

I've always something in their bones that has to happen. To me, that's always so interesting when people say that because they're like, I want to know what that feels like. Yeah, I'm curious. I don't have that one. That's what I mean. I'm like, I don't like I'm an AI robot. I'm like, what is this feeling that you have? I don't know. And I don't want to do it just. Because I'm like, well, time's passing, I should just do it. You're like, but you're not feeling it. And if you're not feeling it, then that's gonna be a, so I just have to stay true to what you feel and it's kind of a weird experience. Maybe your experience is like, I'm never feeling the feeling. And I can't just force my, I, I, I'm not going to force myself to do something out of fear or missing the boat. You should like be called to want to do it because you don't want to bring a kid in this world and you're like, I just did it because I was getting older, right? Yeah, I mean, I went so deep into this journey. I mean, ultimately my ex and I split because I was not ready to start a family with her. And so, you know, I had to like face the decision of like losing the woman I loved or having kids when I didn't feel excited and Um, and you know, we were in therapy for 20 therapy sessions or something, and our relationship therapist who was my mentor when I started my own relationship therapy therapy practice.

He sent me a voice note after like our 18th session and he was like, Corey, it seems like this is all confusing for you. And he's like, I, I really just have two things to say to you. One, don't marry someone unless they're your best friend. 2, don't have kids unless you're excited to have kids. It's like so simple. I know that like so good and yeah, I mean that was for me that was my compass out of the relationship, um. I think what happens, you know, you just get in a relationship, you get super in love and then you get confused and then you have people and friends and family and like you're like, you just get swirled up in all this stuff, you get more variables involved and you're like, it just, life's fucking confusing. And then, yeah, somebody comes along and just says like two simple things a kuna matata and you're like, oh. You're right. There are no worries. Yeah, Funny you mentioned. Well, this has been, I mean, you asked about sort of like, you know, what are, what are the things I'm looking for towards clarity, and this is very much one of them is that I feel like the way I've been building romantic relationships for the start of my life is first, lust.

Then love, then are our values and our lifestyle aligned. Um, which has been great for sexy experiences, but in terms of finding a partner has not been great. And so my experiment now is flipping it, um, slowing things down, like, you know, not starting with lust, not starting with love, which is like not the sparkly exciting stuff, like starting with like alignment, like who are you? like. Do you think everything's God and everything's love and like how do, how are you in conflict and like do you want kids and like, you know, where do you want to live in the world and whatever because I, I honestly think I think we fall in love. I think love is, is more proximity based. It's like the more I spend time with you, the more I love. You. The more I spend time with you, the more I love you. So I think I'm not worried about that experience. The more experiences you have, the deeper you go, the more love has a place to flourish. I agree. I totally, I totally resonate with you. I like, I haven't really been dating anybody for a while because after last relationship, I'm like, I just look at it so differently now where it's like, yeah, that girl's cute and that girl's attractive, but it's like I just see the chaos and I could see the whole thing unfold and it just isn't even kind of interesting. And so you're like looking more of how do I want to be in the world and do things and who would fit that with me more than anything that like feeling of peace and like, Because yeah, the intimacy can be, I feel like developed with many people, right? And the exterior whole thing is like, yeah, when you're young, you're like, oh, she looks this way and she's hot and this is like, yeah, I mean, there's like, there's millions of women all over the world. Like, it's like, but at the end of the day, if the second half of life is so important, You know, you want to do that with somebody who It is very enjoyable with, and I'm not going to do a bunch of shit I don't want to do.

You know, I don't want to go hang out with certain, like, I don't want to go hang out with your family and go do that dumb shit. Like I'm too, I'm too old now to like, I'm set in my ways. I, I don't want to go, you know, Thanksgiving with your family in Wisconsin and, you know, pretend like I give a shit about that or that. It's like, I think, I mean, I think a more important thing to recognize about that too is that it's, it's not even about you. It's like God designed this vessel. Which happens to prefer this and not prefer that. So if you're living in non-preferable nests for this entity, you're misaligned with the design of the entire universe and like everything is one in the way that like you on the surface of the ocean, if someone's like, oh, there's waves out there, and it's like, OK, well give me one. It's like you can't take a wave out of the ocean because a wave is the product of every single other wave in the entire ocean. And so like your preferences are the product of the design of every single relationship between everything in the universe. And so like you living out of alignment with that is like, you know, big fuck you to like the design of everything, um, so I think it's like it's about acknowledging like this is actually who I am and it's different from my stories of who I wanted to be or whatever.

Yeah, it's kind of like I'm you're operating. From a place of observing yourself and what's true to yourself and then just trying to make decisions for the true self, for that self, right? You're like, I, this is just how I am. And I just, I just, and you're just seeing it unfold and you're like, OK, I need to make decisions based on, yeah, this makeup and what this wants, not what I think in my mind anymore. And also that like, I don't know if you experienced this too, but Thinking about your death at the end, right? And reflecting back from then till now, and you're like, You've come here And I feel like you've been given some kind of story you wanna tell. What is that story that this unique individual soul wants to tell? And like as the, you know, as you extinguish what is that.

Like beautifully written masterpiece book, and it's your job to allow What that wants to become. And so you got to get all the other bullshit out of the way, right? Yeah. Yeah, it's been really fascinating to learn about that in the, in the process of writing music, um, because Elizabeth Gilbert has this amazing TED Talk where she talks about her creative writing process and she was like, a lot of people think I'm a good writer. And she's like, that's not actually my talent. My talent is I'm good at sitting in the chair 8 hours a day with my pen on the paper. And she was like, you know, she's like, the word, even the word creative or creator, like I'm a creator of content. I create this book, I create this music. The word creator comes from the same word as God, Creator, to create. And so the idea in all of the ancient times was that art was came through the vessel of a human from God, not that the human being created the art or authored it.

And so I've noticed in the process of music, like when, when I try to write music as Corey, it's really bad. But when I just like open my vessel to music passing through me, like stuff gets written that's insane. Like there's a song that our most popular song, which is called I Am My High, um uh I don't know how to write that song again. And there's, and I felt weird about that and like kind of nervous. They're like, oh, is my career over or like whatever. And I watched this amazing interview with Bob Dylan and I think Anderson Cooper where he was asking Bob, he was like, what, um, how did you write these iconic songs? And Bob Dylan was like, I didn't write those songs. It's like, I have no idea who that person is or how they wrote them, but it's not me now. That's, it's, so Steven Pressfield, he was on Huberman, you know, Steven Pressfield, The War of Art. He write, he writes the, the, the whole book is about. Procrastination as a writer and it's like super funny intro, but it's all about tapping into the muse for writing and it's one of the best humor in episodes because he's such a, He's an older guy who swears, but he's so poetic when he talks, and he does a very similar thing where he trains himself to sit down. And in the opening dialogue of that book is so fucking funny. It is the funniest shit about everything he does to avoid sitting down. It's the funniest dialogue, but he talks about he'll sit down and then he'll write, and he's done it so many years, he's written so many books.

That now, as soon as he sits down, it's like, it used to take him 4 hours for the like flow to come through him. Now because he's done it so long, as soon as he sits down, it's like every single time. And he says his trick is one of them is, it's the consistency, but when he's not at the table, if he has inspiring creative ideas come to him, he doesn't engage with them. He goes, nope, like he allows the tension to build. And only when I sit down. Am I allowed to like let it come through, which is kind of an interesting idea. Instead of like, oh, I have an idea. I'm gonna write this down. I'm gonna play with AI. I'm gonna do this thing. It's like, no, let, like, it's almost like, you know. Holding your seat. You're like, I'm just gonna wait and I'm gonna build up for this one orgasm at this one time, right? And he said, now, as soon as he sits down, he only needs to write for an hour because every time it just, he's trained himself for the last 30 years, now it just comes through immediately, tapping into the muses. And he says, always. End Where like you're like you don't finish the sentence where like you're like, it feels good and you're like going, going, going end there. So as soon as the hour is up, end on that because then you'll just drop right back in. Don't try to complete the yeah, just literally just kind of like end in the middle of it. Yeah. hm I love, I love that. And that's to me, this is part of like what this podcast experiment is, is.

A lot of times you'll miss it, and then you get it, and then you get a taste of it, and then there's moments where You know, if you've listened to a really good podcast between two different people, you can feel when there's that like flow between people where all of a sudden they're lost in a conversation and you're also lost in it with them. And in a lot of ways, that is the creative like flow coming through you. It's that like feeling, right? And then, yeah, just the experiment with like, we're doing vlogs and things. It's like, I think life to me is about letting more of that creative energy just come through you in whatever way that is. That's like one of the biggest, you know, Fun pieces of life. Yeah. Yeah, which is very confusing because it's not directional. Yes, exactly. That's why I think a lot of creators are troubled individuals. Yeah, I mean, it's, it's my, I think my biggest thing that I have to overcome with art is, um, there's this great, there's a poster that I used to print out in front of my desk. Um, I have to remember how it goes, but it's like, um, I'm shit. This is shit.

Um, this is OK. This is great. I'm great. Uh, this is OK. This is shit. I'm shit. And it's like I experienced that all the time where like, you know, I'll have a song and I'm like, oh yes, I'm amazing like I'm going to be a musician like whatever and then 5 days later I'm like I don't even know how to play a note and like, but a lot of that's just like association of the individual. It's like if I separate me as entity from the situation and I'm just like God's just working through me. I'm just trying to listen like um and stop being so outcome oriented or judgmental about how it looks um. But I think that's also like kind of surrendering to any outcome in life, which is something I really want to do, but it's so fucking scary to like let go of all the structures. Like maybe I won't have a relationship when we want to have kids, maybe I stopped doing music, maybe like I become a homeless person. I don't know. Like you have to kind of like, I feel like to really like lean in, you have to be like open to all of the possibilities, um, so I think why like there's not a bunch of gurus walking around. It's like it's like a full send.

I think the key is Sprints mixed with times of deep reflection and then just continually being present, because as long as you're present, you're making the decisions from what you feel is moving you in that moment. And Then people that have gotten to the end of their lives that have regrets. It's because they've been moving through things. Without presence. So they just end up somewhere 10 years later. So, I don't think there ever is a wrong decision. I don't think there's a wrong decision to have kids or not have kids. It's just like, Is that truly in the moment, the next decision I want to make? And if it's yes or no, you just, you're being present to what is your yes and no, and you just see where that takes you. Instead of falling asleep, like, people fall asleep at the wheel. But I think that's why everybody needs to take pauses in their life because life is constantly just sucking you along. And if you don't stop for a second, sometimes you don't even remember what you want or like what you even feel.

How'd you get so much clarity? It seems like you're, you got a relationship that's just crushing. You got a podcast that's on fire. Like it seems like you like know what you want and you're like, you don't get distracted. I'm honored that you believe my illusion. Uh, I think with clarity, it comes in moments. There's an ebb and flow just like with being a creator. Like you said, sometimes it's, I'm shit, this is shit, sometimes it's I'm on fire, and the way I see it is, you know, as a creator, you're channeling this, you know, like you said, this God through you, and sometimes the channel, it's like a river, sometimes the rivers flowing really hard, sometimes it's chill, but it depends on how much is coming from upstream and so that's how I see the I'm shit. The I'm shit is. The river is not flowing that hard, and when things are really cooking, it's when the river is flowing open and your channel is open and clarity I see is the same way. Like there are moments where I have a lot of clarity and Sometimes there's things that happen and there's chaos in your life and you get bogged down by stress and tasks and the menial parts of life and you lose that clarity for a second. But going back to that silence Brent was talking about and taking moments of pause is where we can find it again. So, I feel like I have clarity on a lot of things and I feel like there's still a lot of clarity to be had and it's kind of that Dunning-Kruger effect where, you know, the more you learn about something.

The dumber you become at it or like you know you're the most confident at the beginning and then as soon as you start learning things you're like, oh, I actually know nothing and I'm a complete retard at this and then your confidence goes down as your as your knowledge and skill set goes up. And so, yeah, I think that's, that's how I see the clarity too is it will come. It will come in the silence. Yeah, and, uh, I mainly get. Self-hating thought loops in the silence. Yeah, I think you gotta sit there longer. I think that's why people run ultra marathons because they because the, because the pain that runs ultra marathons loves it. It's because the pain brings the clar because they need to be doing something instead of sitting there. So it's like, I'm just gonna fucking run with these bastards in my head until they stop talking and it's gonna take 56 miles for them to go away for a second and then they get that piece. Yeah, yeah, I mean, I think the most, the most clarity I've ever felt in my life is from grief, um, and I think that's, it's just such a like powerful cutting force everything off, yeah, and I, I always thought that grief was just a lot of sadness when people talked about it. I didn't realize it's like a fundamentally different life experience. Um, how would you describe it?

my experience of it was like. Not knowing how to survive, like not believing that I could get through it, um, and Uh, The the weight of my loss feeling so vast that Everything else lost its meaning, um, except the most precious, meaningful thing, you know, like a phone call with my mom or like, you know, an avocado toast or like things that I actually actually like and like anything in my life that was kind of like meh that I kind of liked um just got shed um because I think it's like when you're doing when you're engaged in a maybe. Your body's kind of like half in it, but you're able to be kind of in your mind. And I think when you're in that, then the grief comes of the loss. The memory of the loss is like with you, and it's like only like when you're in full flow state does the memory of the loss not appear. And so all of a sudden it was like I, the only time I had relief was in flow and suddenly I started being magnetized towards what are the things that are in flow for me, which is fascinating. Like, I mean, now I'm spending most of my time as a body worker and as a relationship therapist.

And like definitely did not think that that was where I was going to be, um, and definitely doesn't feel like I'm the most qualified in those two fields, but that's where I, I feel my flow state. So just like you said, just like Humbly trusting. The path that it seems to be I'm supposed to be on. Um, yeah, I heard somebody say like the depth of your grief is just Feeling the intensity and how much you love that individual. So you're like you're actually feeling love is what it is. It's just a different side of love. Such an interesting way to describe it and kind of a Like an interesting perspective when you're in grief, you're like, Wow, that like that love is that deep, right? It goes back to the non-duality. You wouldn't have that grief without that love. And so yeah, you have to like in order for me to be able to have that amazing relationship, it's like this is the thing that I have to.

Process and go through like because then it's nothing. Yeah, I mean that was such a takeaway for me in this past year this I had an insight about 8 months in I was like, just like you just said, it's like, oh shit, every inch you go into love is an inch you have to back out in grief. Yeah, that's a terrifying realization, right? And I was like, and then it makes you afraid to love or and if that and the flip side, which is fuck, well, like if I really want to love, then I actually should love grief, right? I want, I want more of it. Which I hate both of those things. Like I, I have, I feel like I have some notes for God on the, the design of the next one. Yeah, let's write some letters. I think that's also random, but like having a child, I think that's too for me is like if I don't really think I can truly be there for the kid and provide a really good life and something happens to that kid, the pain. I would feel is almost too great to even comprehend that. Therefore, I don't think I can even, it may break me in a way that taking even the slightest risk of something like that happening, I don't know if I'm able to even be OK to handle it. It's like another thing to consider. Yeah, well, I think that's, I mean, that's what's magical about grief too is that it's, um, it's ability to produce empathy.

It's like I've had a grief experience. I know both of you have had a grief experience, and I like think about how everyone in the world has had a grief experience. Suddenly I feel like a lot more sweetness for the brothers and sisters of the world. You know, I, I can't imagine what losing a child must be like. And my uncle, my uncle lost too. And like now after experiencing grief myself, I'm just like so much more impressed and like in awe of his ability to survive life. After losing kids, yeah, that's a That's amazing. Yeah, fentanyl, actually. So, yeah, you know, hopefully Trump fixes that one, hopefully, yeah, before we, we're running out of time, but before we end, I have, I have a better answer to your clarity question. Why do I feel clear? Because I actually feel behind. And I liken it to a seed in the ground. When a seed grows. It has its roots, but then, you know, it has a certain amount of space before it gets to the, the top soil, and it just goes straight fucking up, right? It's not until it gets out and gets sunlight and does photosynthesis that it creates something new and gets to be something different than everything else, right? It actually blossoms and creates this, you know, maybe I'll have a leaf over here and I could have a flower facing that way, and I can have a leaf on this side, and it creates something that's like.

Going in different directions. Whereas when you're Under the soil, it's just straight up. You just use gravity and you go, OK, that's the direction I go, and it almost feels as though I haven't broken the topsoil. That makes sense. So, I can't express in all these directions, or maybe I can, but it doesn't feel like it. And so I'm just head down going straight. So it's this level of clarity until I reach whatever topsoil is, and I don't even know what that fucking means or what it looks like. So that's a constant journey to figure out where is the topsoil. Maybe I already hit it. I don't know, but it's this feeling of being behind, kind of like you said, you're, uh, you know, uh, the reason you've done so many things is because you have, you know, what did you say you hate yourself or something like that. Don't feel I'm good enough. You don't feel like you're good enough. I gotta, I gotta go be good. Yeah, similar thing. It's like I'm behind, you know, so I'm just gonna put my head down and go straight up, yeah. Well, it's beautiful and I think it's the rarest, most valuable currency on earth, so. Don't stop All I know is any time you you can be 100 people and they all have different.

Like, like you said, your Mexican friend wants sons right away. I've had different clients and they all want completely different lives. It's like there's no wrong answers, no right answer. Some people figure shit out when they're 19 and they go down a whole path and then, and it's like, yeah, or I think everybody's confused. People that have kids, they're like, man, I wish I could do that. And then the people that don't, you're like, maybe I should have done that. And then it's like the grass is greener, and yeah, and if you think anybody has it figured out. You're wrong. And here's another example. Today we're all just bumbling around. We're getting tacos and we're talking to the lady who's selling the fireworks, and I'm thinking to myself. Like, you know, we're around people in Austin and like, are you successful this and that, and you're like, this lady's living probably the most simple life. She probably makes barely any money at this thing, shows us her tattoos of her 12 kids that are she's the most excited about that, and it's like to think of like. Like what her life is like and she's probably like to be like, oh, I'm not there yet. It's like maybe we're 10 times more there or like financially, but we maybe feel less there than maybe she does and more fulfilled. So it's like it's all, it's like it's it's like it's like what the fuck.

Yeah, but then you also, but then you also can't get rid of that because, yeah, you can't base yourself off of others because you're gonna constantly feel behind. But then if you never base yourself off of others, no one would ever exceed expectations to the level that humans do to create such incredible things. So we, it's two sides of the same coin. You have to have it, but it's also the thing that's killing us and keeping us depressed. I don't know. I don't know if somebody can figure it out. Please send it to two funguysbiz@gmail.com and let us don't even know that we've figured out life at all. At this point. We've talked about this shit so much that I don't even know anything anymore. Yeah, well, I think it sounds like wisdom. I think, yeah, I think that we go all the way full circle. Wisdom is knowing that you know nothing. So I think a cool idea for you, if you want an idea, is staying in Guatemala for like an entire year, right, and seeing what kind of Cool shit you can do in that community, right? Especially with like the indigenous and the kids there, like that could be a really Interesting thing. And if, if, if, you know, that land is so nourishing and whatnot, it's like, let her guide you and be in that one place, especially you have that cool hotel to just be there, meet the people that come through. Maybe there's going to be a bunch of people that come through there that you need to meet.

Well, I'll do it if you guys join me. I mean, I, I, I, I, I won't be there for a year, but Austin is a great hub to Guatemala. Like it's like I moved to Austin because it is like my main hub of jumping around, but that's also another hub that I want to spend time in. I won't be there for a year, but we'll come visit. I mean, so real question though, how do we get an international airport in Austin? That's a, that's a great question. I think there's probably a guest on this podcast that probably can make it happen. We could, we could find some people. I mean, technical international airport. Let me just check somebody. Yeah, we can build an airport, right? You're the guy who does things, who does things. Our airport is international. It's just not that you're the jockey hunter, jockey hunter. OK. All right, fair enough. I'll find someone great. Got my homework. That's your next big project I'm at a party. I'm looking, my buddy's looking for an international airport. You don't happen to be an airport architect, do you? No, the weird thing though is, even though you say this, I'm probably gonna run into somebody that's gonna be working on something and it may just happen. That happens to me all the time with this shit. Uh, no, it'd be great because it's only like 3 hours or less, right? If it was a direct flight. It'd be so amazing.

Yeah, it, it's basically, it's like a closer state than even Seattle. It's like it's basically it's our neighbor and Guatemala is more like our neighbor than like the West Coast at this moment. Probably, I would say so. Well, it was a wild ride, fellas. Don't let me talk anymore. I don't know, we gotta get, we've been shooting guns all day, shooting, shooting shots. Tony gave me some mushrooms. My brains are squirrely. Yeah, we took mushrooms, guys. Our brains quesadillas, mushrooms, shot a bunch of guns, and then lost on the freeway. Now, and now we're here. What a great day. Every day in life is such a fucking awesome day, yeah, especially in Austin, especially in your house too, when you were saying like you find the best community in Austin, I was thinking. Especially in your house, the rabbit hole is like the watering hole of the coolest people in Austin. It's just so hard to leave it. I've never had a harder time leaving the house than living there, yeah. Well, thanks for leaving the house today to come, come kick it with us for the day. Yeah, we should take him to a bunch of the bathhouses. We will. We'll go bathhouse tour. Yeah, bathhouse tour. You meet a bunch of interesting people. There's more interesting people.

This whole at this point, at this point, I need to stop meeting interesting people. I'm just having a hard time remembering everyone's names. That is, I don't know anybody's name. That is tough. I don't even know that who's this guy? He barely knows his own name. Sha. I can't spell it. That's for sure. I can't even find my wallet half the time. Yeah, well, Corey. Where do people, what? Yeah, exactly. All right, James, my, my last name is not my real last name, so that's true, that's true. You're not far off. It's jockey Hunter. Get her Doctor Jockey Hunter McGee. That's actually a really good name. Jockey Hunter is a DJ name. Jockey Hunter. Yeah, you're just killing all, slaying all the other DJs. Yeah. I hunt for the best disc jockey, but you wear a horse jockey outfit, like a racing jockey. Awesome. You come up and you have the little slap thing and you're just like, I'm about to jockey this bitch. Well, I do, I do have a new DJ name which is softcore, softcore, yeah, yeah, playing sexy bedroom beats, yeah, instead of hard house. Yeah, you have to do a soft, softcore had daddy B2B.

Oh yes, absolutely. That's a, that's a nice, that would be a nice good. Let's go. Yeah, I think that is what's happening Valentine's Day, technically, yeah, yeah, sweet. So softcore, where do people find you if you want them to find you? Yeah, I would love to. Um, Corey Hunter Music on Instagram has a Linktree to all my various projects and people basically never click on it, but you can find out all the info on the meteorite hunting or treasure hunting or relationship therapy work or 5MEO DMT or whatever from. So really, if you're interested in anything at all whatsoever, just go click on that link and Corey has something for you. Does, does your hotel have an Instagram? Yeah, that Instagram is Amate Atitlan and A A M A T E Amate, which is the endemic tree in the area that's very beautiful. And then Atitlan, A T I T L A N is the lake. Um, so yeah, and my business partner Dars is an insane architecture genius. Yeah, can you build an airport? Uh.

Yeah, he's, he would scale up to that. Yeah. Could you build a Guatemalan podcast studio? I think that's what that's my my my mansion place is a great has the right view for that. So let's do the next conversation there. Well, Corey, thank you brother. It was an absolute pleasure epic. Proud to call you a friend. Glad you're in Austin. Yeah man. What a cool Saturday. What a cool Saturday. What's next? Bathhouse.